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<r t="9.87">i'm getting the feeling that have documentation it team is actually in this room right</r>
<r t="13.25">now</r>
<r t="17.21">so the docking station team has excess this for almost as long as the name</r>
<r t="21.33">project</r>
<r t="22.73">came around and i know it's not with they may snow who were inspired by</r>
<r t="27.95">the red hat labs to write the contention for them</r>
<r t="31.71">and i turned out to be he happened to be really good that</r>
<r t="36.31">and manage the process knowledge onto the rest of the community and that's how we</r>
<r t="40.51">ended up with a docking station team in the first place</r>
<r t="43.98">the month was passed from person to person for few years and eventually shown what</r>
<r t="48.03">can send that out</r>
<r t="49.8">dictator and two thousand three and this year will be his tenth anniversary of the</r>
<r t="55.48">september</r>
<r t="57.43">and eventually we came to name three but that a definite i think three has</r>
<r t="61.51">a question</r>
<r t="65.75">sean has millions</r>
<r t="67.45">and some of them are actually here</r>
<r t="69.72">thank you got millions and he makes good use of us people so it's around</r>
<r t="73.47">all the time</r>
<r t="76.4">who are the contention team well</r>
<r t="79.54">we don't really have a</r>
<r t="83.61">i know</r>
<r t="85.73">E to do something about that</r>
<r t="87.79">it's not enough</r>
<r t="93.21">are you going to submit a patch</r>
<r t="96.14">today</r>
<r t="100.21">one</r>
<r t="103.67">was a committed</r>
<r t="107.66">okay well that i forgot that france the first time</r>
<r t="110.9">i was just think that from memory and there are actually we have about</r>
<r t="115.69">fifty applications that we maintain documentation for on the top of that we have developer</r>
<r t="121.62">documentation the system administrator guys at actually no single person can really keep track of</r>
<r t="127.61">all of that which is probably why i missed your patch</r>
<r t="130.96">and we don't have a formal team structure we have shown results</r>
<r t="136.68">and then we have all of us to do all the work</r>
<r t="139.97">and the we have members who are native english speakers we have people who are</r>
<r t="145.06">not everyone has something to contributes we have over the last year we had twenty</r>
<r t="151.63">five notable contributors</r>
<r t="154.8">seven of whom made significant contributions to lots and lots of projects</r>
<r t="161.6">we have</r>
<r t="164.65">we actually take most of intense for that speech program we have five mentors for</r>
<r t="169.03">willing to mentor intense cordless on the name of page we actually taken things outside</r>
<r t="175.03">of the program as well but is less formally so</r>
<r t="179.12">and that was four years we actually have twelve intense for whom i with us</r>
<r t="183.78">today in this room and up</r>
<r t="187.86">there we go for</r>
<r t="189.65">and six of us and now foundation numbers which i think is actually pretty successful</r>
<r t="194.96">i think we've done really well</r>
<r t="202.6">so we're as we came along we decided welsh on the slide that side he</r>
<r t="208.62">wanted to improve the user documentation and experience for users</r>
<r t="213.47">so previously i can and two minutes of the help was written in top or</r>
<r t="218.59">which is really good for developer help but not actually so good for user help</r>
<r t="222.82">because the first thing you see when you look at the dot book how a</r>
<r t="228.81">double help is just a blank page with an index</r>
<r t="232.16">that's not really very useful</r>
<r t="234.17">i don't help was also written and the hierarchical</r>
<r t="239.31">a structural and focus on</r>
<r t="243.77">describing the user interface</r>
<r t="246.5">and actually who wants to read through a description of the user interface to find</r>
<r t="250.2">out how to achieve some</r>
<r t="252.48">and you want</r>
<r t="254.51">okay the lakers</r>
<r t="256.21">so</r>
<r t="257.59">with names three because the user interface change too much between them two and three</r>
<r t="261.9">and also may of applications change we choose to rewrite the hell in model at</r>
<r t="267.83">which was which is next the mel languages which was designed by sean specifically for</r>
<r t="273.41">user help</r>
<r t="274.63">it when you look a lot of help i mean you will to talk will</r>
<r t="277.01">help it looks very different</r>
<r t="278.9">it's much more task oriented</r>
<r t="281.5">so wanna use a reason to help they</r>
<r t="284.77">generally have like they have something they want to achieve</r>
<r t="288">they look at the user help and they find how to achieve that so instructions</r>
<r t="291.79">how to achieve something rather than</r>
<r t="294.34">have the user interface</r>
<r t="297.27">and thus as i mentioned this to we have a team members from all over</r>
<r t="301.98">the world we tend to write in simple english because firstly it's easier to translate</r>
<r t="306.97">saintly and you want all or nothing you want but may people find it much</r>
<r t="310.58">easier to write and actually many people find it much easier to understand as well</r>
<r t="315.82">and as it turns out it's pretty important because actually user help is not translated</r>
<r t="320.53">very well i we don't have very many translations as you can see from them</r>
<r t="325.72">to name three there has not been much change</r>
<r t="329.3">most of the user hell translations so it's under ten percent translate that i'm sorry</r>
<r t="336.1">most languages the user help is translate the on the simpsons we use help translate</r>
<r t="340.77">that we have had only one language consistently translated to be nine percent if i'd</r>
<r t="346.34">almost a hundred percent at every release and that the spanish</r>
<r t="350.85">so we really appreciate that</r>
<r t="353.33">and would be great if we can somehow encouraged translators to</r>
<r t="357.27">actually translate the user</r>
<r t="359.24">i'll tell you why that's important and that's</r>
<r t="364.3">so our users we</r>
<r t="366.4">have a lot of users gently they're not people who are sitting in this room</r>
<r t="370.76">that help is designed for people who actually don't know how to use application at</r>
<r t="375.57">all</r>
<r t="376.59">all people who have used for many years</r>
<r t="379.48">and we still get it's all useful for people who are here for example if</r>
<r t="383.68">the user interface changes and something you can find some</r>
<r t="387.06">"'cause" the user help well that you will find out that or maybe it's a</r>
<r t="391.71">speech which has been</r>
<r t="393.25">okay i have everything</r>
<r t="395.99">so we can't actually track</r>
<r t="398.01">who reads the desktop help which are construct who reads what they find useful what</r>
<r t="404.01">they didn't find useful</r>
<r t="406.8">the best reviews we gets are actually from translators because they often file bugs within</r>
<r t="414.85">seven days of documents</r>
<r t="417.55">so which is really high because that's long before release usually so we can actually</r>
<r t="422.41">fix things i mean within the team we have a review process as well where</r>
<r t="426.11">in the hell will normally be reviewed by three different people</r>
<r t="431.53">on the other hand users germany and get the runt reporting box six months after</r>
<r t="436.58">the release which can be up to a year after the page was right</r>
<r t="441.61">and this means that so very often by the time they report the but either</r>
<r t="446.24">the U I has changed an application the help as being very rewritten</r>
<r t="450.32">or the problem has already been fixed</r>
<r t="454.25">and if it's and mastery germany but sometimes</r>
<r t="459.06">they might not actually be able to get the fixed without suppression</r>
<r t="462.98">if they might have to actually with another six months to see the fix</r>
<r t="466.85">which isn't very user friendly</r>
<r t="469.98">thanks to hundred every we have actually recently being able to try are uses on</r>
<r t="475.1">like we don't know about or which has proven to be really handy</r>
<r t="479.48">as you can see a it's a particularly good so i've got but you can</r>
<r t="483.25">see the trends and so what that shows</r>
<r t="486.61">is the blue line is unique that's</r>
<r t="490.53">the magenta is unique page fees and the yellow is all each fees on average</r>
<r t="495.62">we get approximately six thousand unique page views a date which is much more than</r>
<r t="500.25">many of the other and then website this by the way covers a user hell</r>
<r t="505.09">and developer help and the system administrator guide</r>
<r t="509.2">and as you can see the trend shows that so</r>
<r t="513.99">we have the most page views on weekdays and that implies that so many of</r>
<r t="520.6">our users for beating the websites are doing so at or rather than</r>
<r t="525.36">which is quite surprising i was actually expecting for most of our users to be</r>
<r t="529.52">using to be reading the help</r>
<r t="531.77">but that's not the case</r>
<r t="538.05">yes when there's nothing on T V</r>
<r t="540.55">and actually along with that's what we found was that the spanish translations all the</r>
<r t="547.19">user help i've been bred much more often than the ritual use help and this</r>
<r t="552.36">is why translations are importance</r>
<r t="555.07">eight out of the top ten read pay most read pages between the user help</r>
<r t="560.49">and the developer documentation happiness five</r>
<r t="565.39">a forced now she's is</r>
<r t="569.5">so that if you pay a few waste that</r>
<r t="573.7">developers and designers can actually help us improve the help before the release</r>
<r t="579.64">because of course we always want to provide the best hope that we can for</r>
<r t="582.54">users</r>
<r t="584.89">so for example designer a applications gonna have tool tips because</r>
<r t="591.41">a button does hasn't in icon so know text</r>
<r t="595.3">then it's very difficult for us to describe</r>
<r t="599.04">and we also need to talk about how to interact with the user interface and</r>
<r t="604.99">will help of design is actually try to top themselves through is as well because</r>
<r t="609.11">if they're not able to describe how user should be interacting with a specific button</r>
<r t="613.62">or label then we probably quantity there</r>
<r t="617.68">so you know they can come talk us or even just come up with a</r>
<r t="620.7">way to describe it themselves</r>
<r t="622.72">and i will help us quite a lot</r>
<r t="626.39">and as for developers and</r>
<r t="629.42">we do try to keep on top of user help on them and time and</r>
<r t="634.52">have it done time for the releases</r>
<r t="636.52">but sometimes you know we don't know about the changes</r>
<r t="640.43">or</r>
<r t="641.93">we can't actually test the latest application easily so we might need help just building</r>
<r t="646.26">it even</r>
<r t="647.58">so that we can see the what it should look like and whether they have</r>
<r t="651.82">been any changes so please file bugs against the have dogs</r>
<r t="655.73">well then when there you i changes problem when there</r>
<r t="659.12">the application starts working differently when the user get something back from application that is</r>
<r t="665.09">not what they used to get</r>
<r t="666.9">so that we can update the help</r>
<r t="669.26">and of course there are some applications which don't this the their shoulder functionality to</r>
<r t="673.77">the user through the user interface X for example there sometimes hidden shortcuts which are</r>
<r t="678.62">mentioned anywhere</r>
<r t="680.49">but still also not good there so it was really help if when your body's</r>
<r t="685.1">so when we were documenting application just come talk to us</r>
<r t="688.5">tell us what we should be looking at</r>
<r t="691.69">that really helps</r>
<r t="693.39">of course as we document your application we will do a full user in a</r>
<r t="698.59">your i review and usability testing we will actually go for your application</r>
<r t="705.2">and we will try to use it as we normally what i tried to use</r>
<r t="709.47">of how other people like you said</r>
<r t="711.99">and the average we find</r>
<r t="714.78">ten or twenty bucks and they application give application what we do that even if</r>
<r t="719.54">nothing has changed in a few months</r>
<r t="722.59">so we will tested for you said do last customer help for it</r>
<r t="730.3">so the moments we are working on developer documentation and the platform overview effort is</r>
<r t="736.53">being but by for the tickle who is over here</r>
<r t="739.43">make sure gonna see</r>
<r t="745.51">it's a an area which has been neglected someone and this</r>
<r t="749.77">desperately need of more work</r>
<r t="752.74">we are restructuring the platform overview almost from scratch</r>
<r t="758.25">have we have new review pages and we will be integrating some of the developer</r>
<r t="764.59">documentation into it</r>
<r t="767.53">so we always we always need help with that so if you have to help</r>
<r t="771.45">that's just come find that's where having it at a</r>
<r t="774.86">i have has so on a for the help so we have implementation i sorry</r>
<r t="779.49">about the documentation that we're have this for next week and also the system administrator</r>
<r t="783.63">guide the guy the system illustrated right hasn't had much love sense</r>
<r t="790.79">before and it three</r>
<r t="792.39">so well to have our system administrators would want to</r>
<r t="797.38">manage their users has changed and the at the moment there is very little documentation</r>
<r t="803.7">about this</r>
<r t="804.86">there's something a few things on the we key</r>
<r t="807.71">so that's what the other every at that were currently focusing on and that there</r>
<r t="812.21">and there are who's doing that there are helping out with that</r>
<r t="817.65">huh</r>
<r t="819.21">and also we have been so busy making sure that all the application help as</r>
<r t="825.08">up to date that we have slightly neglected our startup guide</r>
<r t="828.93">the sell that this document which basically</r>
<r t="832.44">helps a newcomers to the docking station team learn how to</r>
<r t="837.75">right the hell which turned to use which vocabulary to use</r>
<r t="842.29">and grammar</r>
<r t="843.96">and turns</r>
<r t="845.27">all sorts but that's been a bit neglected because we in concentration on the user</r>
<r t="850.51">help so that something about we would like to get on some time soon as</r>
<r t="854.44">we are</r>
<r t="855.45">all those the almost then we have or specially writing these are help all of</r>
<r t="860.88">these are hope and mallard and almost all that's up to date now</r>
<r t="864.24">it's actually gotten to the point where it's quite difficult to find you projects for</r>
<r t="869.55">instance two documents</r>
<r t="871.57">so when i'm with you want to make sense from nothing to P</r>
<r t="875.95">just like to say a big thank you to brian and rate who have provided</r>
<r t="880.08">us with a lot of help and tech support when it came to the system</r>
<r t="883.48">administrator's guide</r>
<r t="885.11">they're the people who wrote the tools so we want the last for the help</r>
<r t="888.66">and they have been very receptive</r>
<r t="891.15">give us a lot of advice</r>
<r t="893.45">and that means that we've actually what we have pretty so far as accurate precise</r>
<r t="898.8">and it's easy to understand</r>
<r t="902.66">a question has proven to be a very basically the best developer to work with</r>
<r t="908.3">a typical what cindy here has support will start talking to him</r>
<r t="913.23">as she was writing the user help for the terminal</r>
<r t="916.87">and he was very receptive to improving the U R E and the</r>
<r t="923.26">basically he provided support when we do that and what station with of the top</r>
<r t="928.22">that's</r>
<r t="929.64">they has been very helpful that's a writing tech support that are happens</r>
<r t="935.65">which we have needed at the last happens we had</r>
<r t="938.4">three out of about eight laptops die on of</r>
<r t="941.91">in the first day</r>
<r t="943.41">that was fun</r>
<r t="946.34">under</r>
<r t="948.07">i that</r>
<r t="950.98">he's also be very patient with our intense and sneak comments as being great yes</r>
<r t="956.4">you have</r>
<r t="958.41">there are beyond a</r>
<r t="962.23">and same for a them adam has</r>
<r t="964.8">actually gone so far as to what for instance through submitting there will potential entrants</r>
<r t="970.69">for that speech problem three submitting the first batches</r>
<r t="973.74">and debugging their problems when trying to build applications that takes a lot of dedication</r>
<r t="981.02">so a big thank you to adam as well</r>
<r t="984.1">so having a few more talks at one thing about the conditions there is one</r>
<r t="988.33">later today i about by getting started videos which are what you see the first</r>
<r t="994.69">time you want to your user account your name user account</r>
<r t="998.72">so he's giving a presentation at six P M today</r>
<r t="1002.81">i like i like talk i think and the pattern twisting right there</r>
<r t="1008.86">it's going to be talking about what we've been doing with the developer documentation over</r>
<r t="1012.89">the last two years market was an outreach program that one well you started you</r>
<r t="1018.41">have your associates last year</r>
<r t="1020.35">but that covers what is a tiffany started on before that</r>
<r t="1025.31">and that's will eventually be integrated with the classroom overview which for that includes working</r>
<r t="1029.33">on so martin stop it's the more at four if you're interested sorry that to</r>
<r t="1034.16">them are to in this room if you're interested and developer documentation do problem that's</r>
<r t="1039.7">what she has to say and then join us for the developer documentation had this</r>
<r t="1044.42">next week</r>
<r t="1046.34">so we're having a developer documentation well i'm sorry hard as for the whole week</r>
<r t="1051.32">and we're also having a system administrator's guide had this for the whole week and</r>
<r t="1055.28">all that we got the both with some international is a dish of people from</r>
<r t="1060.25">that centralisation team will help us i hope make it's easier to write tell</r>
<r t="1065.37">for translators well make it easier for translations to translate that help</r>
<r t="1072.09">so that's i think that's all i've got to say for the last year</r>
<r t="1075.95">you know the question i don't people have lots of questions</r>
<r t="1079.89">awesome</r>
<r t="1083.74">no use also to you want you know if you know use you should also</r>
<r t="1093.66">i think that there are some companies that are using it instead of the</r>
<r t="1099.66">but there aren't any major use out of it outside</r>
<r t="1103.14">we have well she'll have spoken to katie to see they would use</r>
<r t="1110.32">what if you could write something similar to yell it for them to use and</r>
<r t="1114.47">for them to use my lights a friendly lot of the data help but i</r>
<r t="1119.38">just five minutes i think i'm thinking</r>
<r t="1124.83">so i have a question after every release</r>
<r t="1131.35">what sort of testing goes like remote versus the tutorials and things like that make</r>
<r t="1136.1">sure that</r>
<r t="1137.94">they still work against</r>
<r t="1140.43">this is that don</r>
<r t="1142.97">prior to release or i mean we try to do all testing before the release</r>
<r t="1149.32">but what if like me and i stuff so we are actually</r>
<r t="1153.3">we didn't get the developer documentation testing done</r>
<r t="1156.83">because we don't have that people to do that</r>
<r t="1159">that's why save anyone's interest and all the documentation we really very needy</r>
<r t="1163.53">so if i can help you with that</r>
<r t="1166.34">i have</r>
<r t="1170.11">i think this is some sort of this is a function of</r>
<r t="1175.21">outreach your marketing team in which we can ask you can mediate march two</r>
<r t="1180.63">i can people do that especially things like tutorials work that can that can easily</r>
<r t="1185.24">be done</r>
<r t="1188.16">the one is that you have to have image</r>
<r t="1191.47">that we there could do test so that we can that least even or something</r>
<r t="1196.92">provides an image</r>
<r t="1198.85">prior to release</r>
<r t="1200.48">and then</r>
<r t="1203.25">actually so i would be really great if you could that once that actually happens</r>
<r t="1207.4">and as far as i understand austria will help us actually do that that's thing</r>
<r t="1212.09">once that what's because more mature and that's true for translations to translated</r>
<r t="1220.81">documentation</r>
<r t="1222.49">i think we buy documentation all the go always we don't have documentation freezes because</r>
<r t="1227.78">we don't have enough people to actually be able to finish it sometime for free</r>
<r t="1231.4">we might be for the could mean we might be a good</r>
<r t="1235.12">so i thought should indicate how much spare time we have for testing</r>
<r t="1239.75">but we do try to test and we do make sure that's what we actually</r>
<r t="1242.93">might we get for if you saw problem within the team and of course if</r>
<r t="1246.79">anyone else falls about we always say patches welcome if you want to help us</r>
<r t="1250.51">what we fix it</r>
<r t="1252.81">okay all right so i'll so we do it</r>
<r t="1257.5">thanks for helping</r>
<r t="1264.79">have like here</r>
<r t="1270.64">i so you mention that so you have interns to do documentation i guess that</r>
<r t="1277.06">is problem with documentation as much as with many other non cutting tasks the if</r>
<r t="1281.74">you want to be sponsors low paid over there you want to call it to</r>
<r t="1285.5">do any of this work the average for women is really the only thing that's</r>
<r t="1289.41">available do you see that changing going for those of any chance of some money</r>
<r t="1294.85">from elsewhere to get people plates right augmentation to be on is probably not because</r>
<r t="1300.63">most people don't seem to care about age</r>
<r t="1303.43">it's anything users that you</r>
<r t="1306.24">we have another marketing i think</r>
<r t="1311.57">i mean it would be</r>
<r t="1312.79">i added that most of i need like and the dock station team has been</r>
<r t="1316.92">found outreach program and half of our team it's female happens now which is very</r>
<r t="1321.67">usual for and i suppose project</r>
<r t="1324.6">have we have actually had who knew man train it is anything</r>
<r t="1330.85">i think that i think it's becoming very out features and it and i would</r>
<r t="1335.99">actually love to see new members join for not</r>
<r t="1342.58">i think that bring a lot</r>
<r t="1346.28">so about the fact that we say is that a lot of people do</r>
<r t="1353.36">think documentation is important</r>
<r t="1356.91">so from my perspective documentation is right now</r>
<r t="1362.54">my number one focus i</r>
<r t="1365.24">so</r>
<r t="1367.02">comes out of this if you are trying to learn the platform are trying to</r>
<r t="1374.87">try to</r>
<r t="1376.67">do the code samples or things like that</r>
<r t="1379.54">the documentation is this your only guide to actually writing and now</r>
<r t="1386.02">and if you don't have to a let me give you an example so if</r>
<r t="1390.64">you want to write a java script that</r>
<r t="1392.79">everything is we have is just</r>
<r t="1395.64">generated by you know G T K to or you know five O G attic</r>
<r t="1401.24">introspection</r>
<r t="1403.16">we don't if you don't there there's no context and start which you have nothing</r>
<r t="1407.92">that says this is how you're right one in java script from you need a</r>
<r t="1412.43">loop you know that you need to do they need to do that that's</r>
<r t="1416.64">part of java script so if you're we can warrior and you only have time</r>
<r t="1421.75">to do it like myself they're gonna be very frustrated very quickly</r>
<r t="1426.66">and how we get pumped by other everybody else because are documentation is poor and</r>
<r t="1435.28">we're expected to read the code i don't i don't want to read</r>
<r t="1440.23">i wanna see documentation</r>
<r t="1442.39">we also need more people we just want people to like that made one developers</r>
<r t="1446.91">who are willing to write that station or just people but it's not good</r>
<r t="1451.11">so for me as a brand</r>
<r t="1453.87">it affects the right</r>
<r t="1455.59">so and that's how i look at</r>
<r t="1459.44">i happens that that's the number of people who have been looking for documentation well</r>
<r t="1464.8">what occupation right and their application</r>
<r t="1467.87">i have actually just coupled for and they found out there helpless way which isn't</r>
<r t="1472.83">ideal we of course always you want to provide documentation</r>
<r t="1476.6">but unless we actually have more manpower to do it i don't think it who</r>
<r t="1481.07">is like we do have me back to see if there is obviously working on</r>
<r t="1484.4">the development innovation we've done some what we have a have a lot more</r>
<r t="1488.86">where we are finished</r>
<r t="1492.04">first you know the structure of structural thing you about the documentation we just need</r>
<r t="1497.4">for</r>
<r t="1499.16">they</r>
<r t="1504.07">okay</r>
<r t="1505.12">she's</r>
<r t="1508.19">where is</r>
<r t="1509.38">the</r>
<r t="1510.7">still when i was doing the outreach program from and a internship i fell a</r>
<r t="1516.93">lack of documentation to do right documentation that's what the style guide this for still</r>
<r t="1522.93">i so i dutifully went and looked up the style i like to write out</r>
<r t="1526.96">of print and you know slapped on it but i don't at and i didn't</r>
<r t="1532.85">hear commence interviews that is outdated and so you have in place a style guide</r>
<r t="1539.15">that you recommend to read and it is outdated so my question is why are</r>
<r t="1544.93">two guys working here</r>
<r t="1548.46">because we've got too much today</r>
<r t="1551.35">what i don't know hire right now we had solved on the last year</r>
<r t="1556.75">and then we don't have anyone interested enough to do it i was actually going</r>
<r t="1560.06">to right that's myself</r>
<r t="1562.67">four months ago i think but then some other projects came up and i but</r>
<r t="1567.05">i hope for the since that so for example i chose to write that this</r>
<r t="1570.09">me helps the writing style guide</r>
<r t="1572.3">it's just that</r>
<r t="1573.81">we don't as i each individual the T basically a team works as individuals rather</r>
<r t="1579.27">than the whole team unless where it had passed in which case we just put</r>
<r t="1583.64">all are written to one thing and we go out that i will get done</r>
<r t="1588.19">is jennings and to work on what interests ourselves</r>
<r t="1592.28">rather than what</r>
<r t="1594.86">interest what specific people might want it was we take requests and that's why we</r>
<r t="1600.35">fix but we still say twelve about we will fix them</r>
<r t="1605.55">still the cheapest i described widgets right me basically how you can what object is</r>
<r t="1611.99">and how you describe it in your documentation and seems with a the release of</r>
<r t="1616.52">G D get to be in you know on the applications using a the new</r>
<r t="1621.22">G T K tree lot so we just have changed and those do you don't</r>
<r t="1624.45">need a you know a G D B which is not right and she and</r>
<r t="1629.44">how are newcomers to see educations only great and you get supposed to describe this</r>
<r t="1635.04">generally we recommend that they be at the moment like i just finished that if</r>
<r t="1639.12">you know and we recommend that they be that if you know because that's actually</r>
<r t="1642.88">a good example what help should like</r>
<r t="1645.67">and describe based on that but there's where using for them three applications are still</r>
<r t="1649.82">somewhat flocks</r>
<r t="1651.45">for example empathy was are flagship document the project</r>
<r t="1656.78">three years ago now that is somewhat outdated because we have actually able are the</r>
<r t="1662.41">style of motivation has a fall down through this i think it has improve we</r>
<r t="1667.97">had fewer what we took into account the feedback from users based on what they</r>
<r t="1673.01">found confusing and so i would and that will keep evolving process evolving for some</r>
<r t="1678.77">time to come</r>
<r t="1680.59">but it's at the moment we on our project patient the what can we say</r>
<r t="1685.58">which is our application to look at four</r>
<r t="1689.55">and user help</r>
<r t="1691.1">for developer documentation we don't have a specific style guide at all</r>
<r t="1696.93">because that is still being developed</r>
<r t="1701.3">and the if you actually go read was already there but that's not to the</r>
<r t="1705.89">full</r>
<r t="1706.92">so i've just one ones so</r>
<r t="1709.85">at the data that a still by the time for women and when i it</r>
<r t="1716.11">you have a language that is why it's not you know what is going on</r>
<r t="1719.78">with the documentation team and what is a place that i list doesn't have any</r>
<r t="1724.34">of this stuff that you're working on i mean you know what is propose the</r>
<r t="1727.23">system admin guy that the guy and usually there's you could very a quest for</r>
<r t="1732.01">the system administrator right there is a purpose for that well right there are a</r>
<r t="1735.28">separate pages from the application help there</r>
<r t="1738">three cost less and then there are links to sell it to the documentation could</r>
<r t="1743.08">perhaps that G D V saturday included in the tasks for the thousand the page</r>
<r t="1748.73">it okay cool i'll</r>
<r t="1766.86">okay so two things one sort of report to your home</r>
<r t="1773.33">and one about trees</r>
<r t="1778.16">so it's not the</r>
<r t="1781.25">it's just something to help your rights documentation</r>
<r t="1784.28">if you use emacs</r>
<r t="1787.05">emacs is really good for everything X M L based</r>
<r t="1791.33">documentation</r>
<r t="1792.88">and i started a little project called you know emacs you kills</r>
<r t="1796.72">it's my blog</r>
<r t="1798.37">it's basically you download at it's model</r>
<r t="1802.22">you are installed you tell emacs about it</r>
<r t="1805.35">has a condition have to do that</r>
<r t="1807.42">i mean what it does is basically every time you open a model are documents</r>
<r t="1812">in emacs</r>
<r t="1813.33">it's kind of the model are X M L schema</r>
<r t="1816.15">and you have tab completion for the available tax at any point in</r>
<r t="1821.9">in your document so you know if you are inside of that patience have a</r>
<r t="1827.11">section inside of</r>
<r t="1829.32">paragraph people tell you a key right here you can put you know</r>
<r t="1833.5">all emphases or a reference to another thing more linked another it is very nice</r>
<r t="1839.07">it's very useful</r>
<r t="1856.48">so we need style but we definitely nist i would i</r>
<r t="1861.44">well you know when i started writing documentation a</r>
<r t="1866.69">that was when we used a cool and the hope is this immense ocean of</r>
<r t="1871.63">tax</r>
<r t="1873.19">and</r>
<r t="1874.99">emacs really help me there at least you know what i could do at any</r>
<r t="1878.42">point in time or at any point in the document</r>
<r t="1881.75">and you know i had</r>
<r t="1884.01">for that specific case you know that will pass</r>
<r t="1887.62">like i don't know nine different types of lists</r>
<r t="1891.81">one aside my fleece order these variable least</r>
<r t="1895.44">list of</r>
<r t="1897.35">this and that kind of thing and even if you get it wrong the first</r>
<r t="1901.19">time</r>
<r t="1902.35">once you have the content in their it is really easy to change the least</r>
<r t="1906.15">i and the sub element types to something else</r>
<r t="1909.92">you know so</r>
<r t="1912.91">don't be afraid of using the wrong elements type because someone later look at it</r>
<r t="1917.19">and say you know you should be using this one instead and it's really change</r>
<r t="1920.64">but it's getting the content written but these hard part</r>
<r t="1924.14">just in response to send it's actually very similar with my learns you have for</r>
<r t="1929.62">example steps for lists which i think steps and the lists we just for the</r>
<r t="1935.76">list of items terms for the vision turns</r>
<r t="1939.31">and that's what's in a similar way</r>
<r t="1941.41">and the point the whole point so well how to hold a part of the</r>
<r t="1944.91">point of using mallard was the tax should be relatively self expiring three</r>
<r t="1950.85">so as you type it as you write something you should be based on to</r>
<r t="1955.28">get some steps and get some steps and steps why want to show an example</r>
<r t="1960.74">and then you just use an example tag</r>
<r t="1967.21">and this is all fine i mean but that's not personally not only concern what</r>
<r t="1973.01">i'm saying it's a i I G some kinder now and i am i've done</r>
<r t="1979.43">some small features for this that gets clients "'cause" but and down they are they're</r>
<r t="1986.31">using a lot of me which it some G T K tree and i had</r>
<r t="1989.63">that i never seen them before i mean these they're very new show there is</r>
<r t="1993.32">like G D G T K had of are now i have for someone who</r>
<r t="1997.73">is waiting documentation for this like let's look let's go back and look from and</r>
<r t="2001.7">you'll be point of view of how will how will they describe our how will</r>
<r t="2005.85">they know what's ahead of our do they maybe that person thinks okay this is</r>
<r t="2009.61">the top but are is not think of the same thing i had to the</r>
<r t="2013.17">developer documentation actually requires prior there is that we have it you have to know</r>
<r t="2018.34">what you're describing</r>
<r t="2020.28">so you have to actually develop the call that were or what about right you</r>
<r t="2026.65">should vision for you</r>
<r t="2028.75">i mean you really so that's where most are still have a little overview a</r>
<r t="2034.95">whole different parts from this</r>
<r t="2037.6">thank you or would have time to recruit these or</r>
<r t="2042.8">both kinds of things and then we can start looking for from that we get</r>
<r t="2046.85">this is a some advices ripping right there is a cell phones and also and</r>
<r t="2051.54">they what's to say something so file i guess say what's missing something also start</r>
<r t="2058.5">let's about is it is a problem recently if you're interested will actually go for</r>
<r t="2063.62">the presentation about something you would sort of in detail but reputations and of course</r>
<r t="2069.22">all these things which recovering so if you could to discuss redevelopment vision that which</r>
<r t="2073.6">recovery you will see this thing so that even visually created an idea some of</r>
<r t="2077.7">the new features that you might want to be looking at but at some things</r>
<r t="2081.75">that you know somebody we started documentation now we don't know the documentation is supposed</r>
<r t="2085.75">to be we have low entry barrier and you're taking people who don't have a</r>
<r t="2090.01">fourteen experience so it's like a chicken any problem you want to know that of</r>
<r t="2094.47">the documentation exist that these are like really new people so they don't hope for</r>
<r t="2099.03">salvation is not really intended for self is that you maybe you have to know</r>
<r t="2103.76">what they're doing show it is it is a requirement that you need to specify</r>
<r t="2107.22">probably a on the page before you know people line</r>
<r t="2112.47">we have people contributing not very good outreach program and we actually there is</r>
<r t="2119.17">really have very many what with this year we have a have a and that's</r>
<r t="2122.47">what about the documentation we had that we currently out there for the user helping</r>
<r t="2126.45">you to use a help as well last year we had four and there is</r>
<r t="2130.81">for developer documentation they to start from scratch so i think it's to them along</r>
<r t="2135.5">a lot of time to get up to speed</r>
<r t="2137.58">i have martin can probably say something about that if some parts her microphone</r>
<r t="2159.22">i am working i'm trying to work on that</r>
<r t="2165.6">on something that you might like</r>
<r t="2168.9">it's the it's a</r>
<r t="2171.17">you something can there is the door you know</r>
<r t="2174.31">so far it's just for</r>
<r t="2176.57">dig a</r>
<r t="2178.37">i would like</r>
<r t="2180.21">to have something like that to for other libraries the i'm working on the one</r>
<r t="2186.59">for by then</r>
<r t="2188.53">mad for the market is upstairs because we i might for the is working on</r>
<r t="2196.4">something similar for javascript</r>
<r t="2201.61">and actually my talk tomorrow about this project</r>
<r t="2206.05">so i are you getting to be talking about how you actually started right to</r>
<r t="2209.2">help us and you come right yes</r>
<r t="2211.84">issue becoming</r>
<r t="2214.35">that's good that's good for me irina</r>
<r t="2217.58">and i think sites also have on site</r>
<r t="2221.84">okay</r>
<r t="2225.37">i just i something what's in the say as and things that need of more</r>
<r t="2230.1">documentation on the B P a one of things that i have some but depending</r>
<r t="2234.58">on but then one of these is to do with experiments you i am hoping</r>
<r t="2237.78">that should i wouldn't want in here don't getting that we use because i as</r>
<r t="2242.05">well you know some stuff one experiment you i interviewed use but i think it's</r>
<r t="2246.62">more to do it the fact that they're not</r>
<r t="2250.62">i don't we're going to be because i had like use experiment us but mine</r>
<r t="2256.09">as for one of the but then it still don't know how to</r>
<r t="2259.06">and i</r>
<r t="2260.39">couldn't really find documented and you know stuff on the big on this or maybe</r>
<r t="2264.08">i haven't been can probably</r>
<r t="2266.68">well</r>
<r t="2268.99">if it's not there</r>
<r t="2270.47">thank you can out that</r>
<r t="2272.35">it should actually right that the patient i'm you know i'm just seen that i</r>
<r t="2276.21">might don't know how to experiment un</r>
<r t="2280.09">in i okay so for start but it's not that we key we did not</r>
<r t="2286.3">have any documentation about that</r>
<r t="2289.25">the location for that is on the project about website</r>
<r t="2294.74">and there is some degradation about that but it's still</r>
<r t="2298.72">okay by than a space it's really as experimental we don't know which way will</r>
<r t="2302.44">get better does a lot of work with that</r>
<r t="2304.91">so personally i find of the best thing to do is actually look at examples</r>
<r t="2308.23">of that this work</r>
<r t="2309.71">different how to use it</r>
<r t="2311.4">i think it does but have you have anything to say that's about</r>
<r t="2317.53">so</r>
<r t="2319.19">but it's sure it's</r>
<r t="2321.94">course for books about most experiments this is</r>
<r t="2328.21">and all that this implement that we will go or it's a moving target also</r>
<r t="2333.41">changing we maybe have also you know sledge my lower the biggest visual know ricky</r>
<r t="2342.16">which are realists</r>
<r t="2345.1">men's from the experiment on them snakes basis that i want to implement the you</r>
<r t="2349.56">know</r>
<r t="2350.61">so that's probably the only resource new one more workable</r>
<r t="2363.14">we have us</r>
<r t="2365.94">just a quick comments</r>
<r t="2369.03">what on one know the your slides there is a library but know that and</r>
<r t="2373.54">i think it changed to help that know that all know that is actually not</r>
<r t="2378.67">the case lightly cover is held about sitting</r>
<r t="2385.91">so when you get like we the first thing you see is a user is</r>
<r t="2390.72">developers system straight i want to actually click on this is will take the something</r>
<r t="2397.32">but actually like that what websites we get from that covers all of have to</r>
<r t="2402.27">use it developer and this is a straight guy</r>
<r t="2407.49">we have some time for some more questions anybody</r>
<r t="2415.62">so that so i mean we king mo P flow</r>
<r t="2422.31">what's your strategy for the next so i don't know speaks</r>
<r t="2427.26">something like that and it does seem like a lot of stuff found</r>
<r t="2434.18">it's not clear</r>
<r t="2438.45">to me and what is most important to be like</r>
<r t="2444.26">we do not have a very diverse team and as i was saying most of</r>
<r t="2448.83">us prefer to work on user help because that's a lot of about to have</r>
<r t="2453.51">very few developers and the documentation team which has proven to be a problem</r>
<r t="2458.03">but generally people working there is that they're interested because that's where they must matrix</r>
<r t="2463.51">to work</r>
<r t="2464.94">so i hope so for most the contributors i expect will be working on maintaining</r>
<r t="2472.04">the user help for they could is leading that right for the developer hell</r>
<r t="2478.01">that that's our entire happy working on the system administrator but i plan to continue</r>
<r t="2482.84">working on that</r>
<r t="2484.54">we have brian voices well who has been working who has started that how do</r>
<r t="2490.58">i series of the week E and all that's actually just one of these different</r>
<r t="2494.25">things if we were to constraint on one for start it would not be good</r>
<r t="2497.7">use of our time because some of us do not are not very good in</r>
<r t="2501.15">that area</r>
<r t="2502.4">of course we can amend have to but that would just me that we would</r>
<r t="2506.48">have to give up working in other areas to be able to achieve</r>
<r t="2510.99">okay so no my question online and so</r>
<r t="2517.73">what's your strategy and for the better no what's your strategy D to have like</r>
<r t="2523.76">a set a so plan come a because it i</r>
<r t="2529.92">if it can be difficult i think for people to you can vote still didn't</r>
<r t="2534.61">know</r>
<r t="2535.92">you know how to how to style and</r>
<r t="2541.48">i think</r>
<r t="2543.08">i think</r>
<r t="2547.34">i this is all the goal currently for the developer who is to finish then</r>
<r t="2554.47">you buy from a fee which the go for developer help is to finish the</r>
<r t="2559.5">platform of review which is which is and gets so anyone can go look that</r>
<r t="2566.93">where we are i thing you descriptions for various areas of about form</r>
<r t="2572.7">i swear moving the we're moving the that is that's what has be working on</r>
<r t="2579.47">into that</r>
<r t="2581.06">i once that's complete that will be development or</r>
<r t="2585.23">so where overhauling about from scratch</r>
<r t="2589.37">we have</r>
<r t="2591.52">i know</r>
<r t="2595.58">for the user how it's now getting to the point where it's primarily made sense</r>
<r t="2600.74">if you go on to our we key</r>
<r t="2603.35">which you will find so we got a little functions documentation project</r>
<r t="2610.11">and that youtube application helped us page you will see all the application help supplement</r>
<r t="2616.82">english that there</r>
<r t="2618.53">and it actually has individual states this</r>
<r t="2622.06">our aim is to get all of the states as into green which is complete</r>
<r t="2627.12">done for if you</r>
<r t="2628.69">and ready to be shipped</r>
<r t="2630.94">and that is basically are ongoing maintenance we have i mean this now finishing the</r>
<r t="2636.56">last</r>
<r t="2637.5">all day user help which experience of from the top block as far protection</r>
<r t="2655.6">any other questions</r>
<r t="2658.93">i think we can take another question anybody</r>
<r t="2662.67">is just a couple of minutes left</r>
<r t="2671">okay thank you</r>
</data>
